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[pedrolabasulo]

Can someone please shed light on this tennis racket swing index, what is the significance on this while playing tennis.

[racketwiz]

Swing index is basically a manufacturer’s guide to help players in their racquet selection.  Different manufacturers have different designations for this index but they utilize one or more of the following categories: a) skill level; b) length of strokes; or c) swing speed.  Although these indexes vary among manufacturers, these indexes are based on the same concept of a control-to-power scale.  The idea is to match a player with the appropriate racquet.

The control end of this control-to-power scale feature racquets that are ideal for advanced players, long strokes, or fast swing speeds. The power end of the scale feature racquets that are ideal for beginners, short or compact strokes, and slow swing speeds. The area in the middle of the scale is occupied by racquets that are ideal for intermediates, medium-length strokes, or medium swing speeds.

The significance of this lies in the potential performance characteristics that the racquet is designed for.  A player who has short strokes and slow swing speed will not appreciate the performance potential of a Federer racquet.  A player like this would be better served by a power racquet that is light (to help speed up the swing), stiff (to help drive the ball deeper), large heads (larger sweetspots and higher margin of error) and perhaps head heavy (to add some power to weak shots).  Conversely, the performance potential of a Federer racquet can only be realized when used by a skilled player. Players who have high swing speeds, long strokes and/or can generate their own pace need racquets that offer more control and precision, ie, heavier, smaller head, more flexible and even to head light balances.

Unfortunately for regular players like us, the technological overload crammed by manufacturers down our throats and the sheer number of racquet models in the market makes for a strenuous and confusing choice.  The fact that a racquet demo program is largely non-existent in the Phils. makes the selection process a crap shoot.  A player has no choice but to make his or her racquet work for him/her to the extent of compromising their games, unless one is extremely lucky to pick the right one.

Fortunately for the PTO (insert shameless self-promotion and aggrandizement here, hehehe), you have someone like me to guide you through all the technobabble and technical specs, and to help increase the probability that you end up with the right racquet.  If at all possible, demo the racquet first before you buy and see how it plays for you.  Without any demos, all we can go with are benchmark technical specs (which I have) to help us predict how the racquet will perform.  Not an exact science but still way better than guessing and hoping a racquet will play well for you.

Please don’t ever choose a racquet because a particular pro is using it.  I don’t care what manufacturers say but pro sticks are customized.  The best rule of thumb in racquet selection is be honest about your game and physical capabilities, and pick a racquet accordingly.  If the choice comes down to a few racquets, I can help narrow the choice down by comparing the nitty-gritty specs.

[max_alvarado]

mr. racketwiz,

i've got a question.   i'm playing with a dunlop mfil 300 and i love it.   the only thing i dont like about it is the fact it's so light for me.   i usually lead it up from the 10 to 2 (the whole plastic guard basicly).   i've demoed the 200 version of it which is heavier but the feel just isn't the same.  so my theory is that  since the difference of the 2  being only the swingweight and string pattern i need a racket that is hefty but easier to swing (lighter swingweight).  am i correct in my assumptions?   demoing rackets cost so if you could give me an advice to which racket to try out it might help me out financially hehehe...   


i'm currently looking at demoing the yonex rdx 500 (heavier at 12 ounces yet same string pattern) and the volkl dnx 9.   any other suggestions?  someone also told me to try the mfil 200 again at a lighter tension.   i have it strung at 60lbs. (the 300 i have and the 200 i demoed).

thanks,

max

[LVL]

Hi Racketwiz!  Many many thanks for sharing to PTO your technical expertise!  We do appreciate it very much!

[pedrolabasulo]

Swing index is basically a manufacturer’s guide to help players in their racquet selection.  Different manufacturers have different designations for this index but they utilize one or more of the following categories: a) skill level; b) length of strokes; or c) swing speed.  Although these indexes vary among manufacturers, these indexes are based on the same concept of a control-to-power scale.  The idea is to match a player with the appropriate racquet.

The control end of this control-to-power scale feature racquets that are ideal for advanced players, long strokes, or fast swing speeds. The power end of the scale feature racquets that are ideal for beginners, short or compact strokes, and slow swing speeds. The area in the middle of the scale is occupied by racquets that are ideal for intermediates, medium-length strokes, or medium swing speeds.

The significance of this lies in the potential performance characteristics that the racquet is designed for.  A player who has short strokes and slow swing speed will not appreciate the performance potential of a Federer racquet.  A player like this would be better served by a power racquet that is light (to help speed up the swing), stiff (to help drive the ball deeper), large heads (larger sweetspots and higher margin of error) and perhaps head heavy (to add some power to weak shots).  Conversely, the performance potential of a Federer racquet can only be realized when used by a skilled player. Players who have high swing speeds, long strokes and/or can generate their own pace need racquets that offer more control and precision, ie, heavier, smaller head, more flexible and even to head light balances.

Unfortunately for regular players like us, the technological overload crammed by manufacturers down our throats and the sheer number of racquet models in the market makes for a strenuous and confusing choice.  The fact that a racquet demo program is largely non-existent in the Phils. makes the selection process a crap shoot.  A player has no choice but to make his or her racquet work for him/her to the extent of compromising their games, unless one is extremely lucky to pick the right one.

Fortunately for the PTO (insert shameless self-promotion and aggrandizement here, hehehe), you have someone like me to guide you through all the technobabble and technical specs, and to help increase the probability that you end up with the right racquet.  If at all possible, demo the racquet first before you buy and see how it plays for you.  Without any demos, all we can go with are benchmark technical specs (which I have) to help us predict how the racquet will perform.  Not an exact science but still way better than guessing and hoping a racquet will play well for you.

Please don’t ever choose a racquet because a particular pro is using it.  I don’t care what manufacturers say but pro sticks are customized.  The best rule of thumb in racquet selection is be honest about your game and physical capabilities, and pick a racquet accordingly.  If the choice comes down to a few racquets, I can help narrow the choice down by comparing the nitty-gritty specs.

bro rackewiz,  so the factors affecting swing index are the ff:
1 skill level
2 length of stroke
3 swing speed

skill level is a subjective factor and immeasurable, does  i may say swing index is the ratio of length of stroke vs the swign speed? or the other way around?



how can we measure swing index?

[racketwiz]

mr. racketwiz,

i've got a question.   i'm playing with a dunlop mfil 300 and i love it.   the only thing i dont like about it is the fact it's so light for me.   i usually lead it up from the 10 to 2 (the whole plastic guard basicly).   i've demoed the 200 version of it which is heavier but the feel just isn't the same.  so my theory is that  since the difference of the 2  being only the swingweight and string pattern i need a racket that is hefty but easier to swing (lighter swingweight).  am i correct in my assumptions?   demoing rackets cost so if you could give me an advice to which racket to try out it might help me out financially hehehe...   


i'm currently looking at demoing the yonex rdx 500 (heavier at 12 ounces yet same string pattern) and the volkl dnx 9.   any other suggestions?  someone also told me to try the mfil 200 again at a lighter tension.   i have it strung at 60lbs. (the 300 i have and the 200 i demoed).

thanks,

max

To all,
Max brought up a couple of important technical issues in his query: weight and swingweight. 

Here’s a couple of tips I’d like to share:
To test a racquet’s weight, hold the racquet in a vertical position and move it up and down. This gives you a more realistic feel of a racquet’s actual weight. To test a racquet’s swingweight, hold the racquet in a horizontal position and swing it from side to side. This should give you a feel of how heavy the racquet feels in motion.

Weight and swingweight are two different things and should not be confused with each other. Heavy racquets do not necessarily have high swingweights. Matter of fact, it is not unusual for a lightweight but head-heavy racquet to have a higher swingweight than a heavier but head-light racquet.

[racketwiz]

mr. racketwiz,

i've got a question.   i'm playing with a dunlop mfil 300 and i love it.   the only thing i dont like about it is the fact it's so light for me.   i usually lead it up from the 10 to 2 (the whole plastic guard basicly).   i've demoed the 200 version of it which is heavier but the feel just isn't the same.  so my theory is that  since the difference of the 2  being only the swingweight and string pattern i need a racket that is hefty but easier to swing (lighter swingweight).  am i correct in my assumptions?   demoing rackets cost so if you could give me an advice to which racket to try out it might help me out financially hehehe...   

i'm currently looking at demoing the yonex rdx 500 (heavier at 12 ounces yet same string pattern) and the volkl dnx 9.   any other suggestions?  someone also told me to try the mfil 200 again at a lighter tension.   i have it strung at 60lbs. (the 300 i have and the 200 i demoed).

thanks,

max

The difference between the MFil 300 and 200 goes way beyond swingweight and string pattern.  It’s like apples and oranges. You haven’t told me how much lead tape you added, but if you leaded it up from 10 to 2 with half-inch tape, I’m guessing you added around 24 inches total, equivalent to about 12g of lead. That adds about 4 pts to the already head-heavy balance, and although it brings the swingweight closer to the MFil 200’s, it also becomes less maneuverable than before. Stringing the dense 200 at a lower tension might give you a stringbed stiffness similar to the open 300, but the different string patterns will not respond the same way so don't even bother. In all, there’s just too much of a technical disparity between the two to make it feel similar.

If you’re looking to bulk up your 300 and make it more maneuverable, I have a suggestion. You might have added lead tape on the wrong end of the racquet. Why not remove the lead tape you have on the head and put it on the handle (under the grip)? Play with it for a little bit and let me know how it works out.

The RDX 500 comes in 3 different models, but I take it that you’re referring to the midplus with the 16x19 pattern. It is heavier than the 300 at 322g and has a 5.6-pt head-light balance, but the flex and swingweight are similar to the 300.  The DNX 9 is similar to the RDX 500 in weight, balance and swingwt, but is stiffer. Both RDX and DNX look like good demo candidates on paper.  ATBE, the Volkl should give you slightly more pop.  You may also want to check out the Babolat Pure Control MP Team. You might like this one.

The basic specs:
MFil 300: 98 sq.in., 309g, 63 flex, 308 swingwt., 2.2 pts head-heavy, 16x19 string pattern
MFil 200: 95 sq.in., 346g, 58 flex, 337 swingwt., 4.9 pts head-light, 18x20 string pattern
RDX 500: 98 sq.in., 322g, 64 flex, 306 swingwt., 5.6 pts head-light, 16x19 string pattern
DNX 9: 98 sq.in., 320g, 68 flex, 312 swingwt., 5.6 pts head-light, 16x19 string pattern
Bab PCt: 100 sq.in., 327g, 63 flex, 325 swingwt., 5.6 pts head-light, 16x20 string pattern

[max_alvarado]

i tried lead on the handle before i leaded up the head.   it felt okay but the primary problem i had was that I feel as if i was 'passing' through the ball and not going through it.   maybe it's just psychological?  any other suggestions to the location where to put the lead tape?  im confused as to what to do now. 


anyways, i'll take a look at the babolat rackets.   thanks.   

[racketwiz]

bro rackewiz,  so the factors affecting swing index are the ff:
1 skill level
2 length of stroke
3 swing speed

skill level is a subjective factor and immeasurable, does  i may say swing index is the ratio of length of stroke vs the swign speed? or the other way around?



how can we measure swing index?

Swing indexes are not measurements of strokes or swing speed, per se. In fact, it has nothing to do with skill level, stroke, or swing speed.  It is a technical designation of racquet’s performance intent, and the numbers are derived from the racquet’s design specs.  For instance, Wilson uses the term “swing index” and expresses it in the form of a numeric followed by the suffix “si”.  A higher si indicates a racquet with more control while a lower si indicates a racquet with more power.  Prince has something like it called “Power Level”, and they use a numeric followed by the suffix “PL”.  A higher PL indicates a racquet with more power while a lower PL indicates a racquet with more control.

Skill level is generally classified as beginner, intermediate and advanced. Length of stroke is either compact/short, medium or long/full. Swing speed is either slow, medium or fast.   The idea is to categorize yourself within these classifications and then find the racquet with the appropriate swing index, or power level. Generally: control-oriented racquets are suited for advanced players, long strokes, and/or fast swings; and power-oriented racquets are suited for beginners, short strokes, and/or slow swings.

Example: I am an advanced player with an NTRP of 7.0. I have long and full strokes.  I have a consistently fast swing speed. I can generate my own power. If I were looking at Wilson, I’d be looking for racquets with a higher “si”, and these sticks can be found on the control side of the scale.  For Prince, I’d be looking for low “PL” numbers. Low “pl” translates to more control and these racquets will be on the low power (control) side of the scale.

Different manufacturers use different designations to classify their racquets according to the control-to-power scale, and it gets confusing when you go from one brand to another.  To level the field, I use a modified formula based on Prince’s calculation of its PL, using variables such as head size, length, weight, flex, balance, swingwt, etc.  This formula standardizes this “swing index” across brands and manufacturers, making it possible to compare several brands against each other regardless of si, PL, or whatever else the brand uses.

Example:
Control-oriented racquets (lower numbers):
Dunlop MFil 300 – 1902
Fischer M Pro No.1 – 1829
Head Flexpoint Prestige MP – 2037
Prince O3 Tour – 1903
Volkl DNX 9 – 2079
Wilson nSix.One Tour – 1933
Yonex RDX 500 MP – 1919

Higher numbers indicate a shift to racquets with more power.

[racketwiz]

i tried lead on the handle before i leaded up the head.   it felt okay but the primary problem i had was that I feel as if i was 'passing' through the ball and not going through it.   maybe it's just psychological?  any other suggestions to the location where to put the lead tape?  im confused as to what to do now. 


anyways, i'll take a look at the babolat rackets.   thanks.   

By placing lead on the handle, you made the racquet more head-light, hence the "passing thru" sensation. In this case, let's triangulate the weight.  12g on the handle PLUS 6g on the head (3g each on the 10 and 2 position). The 6g on the head should move the balance point about 3 pts toward the head and the increase in swingweight should give you some mass behind the ball. Let me know how this works.

[Francis]

...  You may also want to check out the Babolat Pure Control MP Team. You might like this one...

I read somewhere that Chris Sports in Glorietta is launching new Babolat products this Friday-Sunday, Feb 16-18. FYI.

[pedrolabasulo]

bro rackewiz,  so the factors affecting swing index are the ff:
1 skill level
2 length of stroke
3 swing speed

skill level is a subjective factor and immeasurable, does  i may say swing index is the ratio of length of stroke vs the swign speed? or the other way around?



how can we measure swing index?

Swing indexes are not measurements of strokes or swing speed, per se. In fact, it has nothing to do with skill level, stroke, or swing speed.  It is a technical designation of racquet’s performance intent, and the numbers are derived from the racquet’s design specs.  For instance, Wilson uses the term “swing index” and expresses it in the form of a numeric followed by the suffix “si”.  A higher si indicates a racquet with more control while a lower si indicates a racquet with more power.  Prince has something like it called “Power Level”, and they use a numeric followed by the suffix “PL”.  A higher PL indicates a racquet with more power while a lower PL indicates a racquet with more control.

Skill level is generally classified as beginner, intermediate and advanced. Length of stroke is either compact/short, medium or long/full. Swing speed is either slow, medium or fast.   The idea is to categorize yourself within these classifications and then find the racquet with the appropriate swing index, or power level. Generally: control-oriented racquets are suited for advanced players, long strokes, and/or fast swings; and power-oriented racquets are suited for beginners, short strokes, and/or slow swings.

Example: I am an advanced player with an NTRP of 7.0. I have long and full strokes.  I have a consistently fast swing speed. I can generate my own power. If I were looking at Wilson, I’d be looking for racquets with a higher “si”, and these sticks can be found on the control side of the scale.  For Prince, I’d be looking for low “PL” numbers. Low “pl” translates to more control and these racquets will be on the low power (control) side of the scale.

Different manufacturers use different designations to classify their racquets according to the control-to-power scale, and it gets confusing when you go from one brand to another.  To level the field, I use a modified formula based on Prince’s calculation of its PL, using variables such as head size, length, weight, flex, balance, swingwt, etc.  This formula standardizes this “swing index” across brands and manufacturers, making it possible to compare several brands against each other regardless of si, PL, or whatever else the brand uses.

Example:
Control-oriented racquets (lower numbers):
Dunlop MFil 300 – 1902
Fischer M Pro No.1 – 1829
Head Flexpoint Prestige MP – 2037
Prince O3 Tour – 1903
Volkl DNX 9 – 2079
Wilson nSix.One Tour – 1933
Yonex RDX 500 MP – 1919

Higher numbers indicate a shift to racquets with more power.

tnx for the infos bro ...more power to you

[racketwiz]

No prob, amigo. If you need a comparative "swing index" between racquets, just post it here. Using my "Power Index (pi)" designation, we can compare any racquet out there regardless of brand or model.

[pedrolabasulo]

kaya pala pag gumamit ako ng SI 4.3 hyper carbon , inconsistent tira ko, nd ko talaga macontrol, coz i tend to execute the stroke in a long and full strokes, dapat pala half swing...

now im using my 6.3 SI hyper carbon racket, looks like i got the answer 

tnx once again bro racketwiz...

[max_alvarado]

i tried lead on the handle before i leaded up the head.   it felt okay but the primary problem i had was that I feel as if i was 'passing' through the ball and not going through it.   maybe it's just psychological?  any other suggestions to the location where to put the lead tape?  im confused as to what to do now. 


anyways, i'll take a look at the babolat rackets.   thanks.   

By placing lead on the handle, you made the racquet more head-light, hence the "passing thru" sensation. In this case, let's triangulate the weight.  12g on the handle PLUS 6g on the head (3g each on the 10 and 2 position). The 6g on the head should move the balance point about 3 pts toward the head and the increase in swingweight should give you some mass behind the ball. Let me know how this works.

thanks racketwiz,  i'm going to give it a couple of days to see how it'll feel.  btw, where are u at? 

[rock_it_man]

No prob, amigo. If you need a comparative "swing index" between racquets, just post it here. Using my "Power Index (pi)" designation, we can compare any racquet out there regardless of brand or model.

racket_whiz,

i need a racket for my son, he currently uses an  i.prestige mid and i can't find a similar model (out of stock & production?)  here in manila for him to use as a spare.   can you suggest other racket brands / models  close to the  specs  (flex, stiffnes, etc.) of  i.prestige mid?  would really appreciate your expert opinion cause you're the pro, bro.  thanks man.

[racketwiz]

Max,
I'm in New Jersey.

[racketwiz]

No prob, amigo. If you need a comparative "swing index" between racquets, just post it here. Using my "Power Index (pi)" designation, we can compare any racquet out there regardless of brand or model.

racket_whiz,

i need a racket for my son, he currently uses an  i.prestige mid and i can't find a similar model (out of stock & production?)  here in manila for him to use as a spare.   can you suggest other racket brands / models  close to the  specs  (flex, stiffnes, etc.) of  i.prestige mid?  would really appreciate your expert opinion cause you're the pro, bro.  thanks man.

Can you tell me about when the racquet was purchased and where?  The thing is, there are two versions of the i.Prestige mid. The first model came out in 2001 then a second model was introduced around late 2001-early 2002.

[rock_it_man]

racketwiz,

methinks it was the 2nd model  i.prestige mid,  although it was purchased only last year (on sale) .  anyway, the racket is all black with silver trim on the hoop.  the son's itching for a spare and i can't seem to find one, and is reluctant to try out other models, hiyang daw siya sa palo ng raketa niya.  any other options (models) you may recommend?

thanks wizard

[racketwiz]

Rock_it_man,

I’m inclined to believe that your son has the first version of the i.prestige mid.  The thing is, both models look cosmetically identical but the specs are different.  Just to make sure we have the right version, is it possible for you to name another racquet that weightss close to your son’s i.prestige?  Or better yet, can you have it weighed (kilograms or grams, either way is good)? Weight is one of the major differences in the two versions.

Meanwhile, I’ll prepare a short list of similar racquets, one for each version.

[rock_it_man]

hi wiz,

i recall the weight (printed on a card)  at around  330 grams / 11.6 oz.

[racketwiz]

In that case, it's the first version. Let me work on that and see what we come up with.

[racketwiz]

Based upon the specs, my first substitute choice would be the LiquidMetal Prestige.  Second choice would be the Wilson ROK.  I would recommend, however, to demo any of these racquets before committing to a purchase.  I’ll find out from a couple of people I know if we can get an i.prestige mid.  It’s a long shot given that it’s been 6 yrs since this one came out, but you never know. I’ll let you know what I find out.

The spec sheet is attached. Please download and print for your reference.

[max_alvarado]

hey racketwiz,

i've played with the new setup on my racket and it felt pretty good.  i didn't get as much depth since i'm getting more spin but after a few more swings i just practically aim higher and all is well.   


also, i was just rereading your posts and i failed to see one that you posted earlier?  all the specs that you said is different from where i purchase my rackets???  dunno how that is?   maybe strung/unstrung??

i go to tennis-warehouse  btw! 

your post.....

The basic specs:
MFil 300: 98 sq.in., 309g, 63 flex, 308 swingwt., 2.2 pts head-heavy, 16x19 string pattern
MFil 200: 95 sq.in., 346g, 58 flex, 337 swingwt., 4.9 pts head-light, 18x20 string pattern
RDX 500: 98 sq.in., 322g, 64 flex, 306 swingwt., 5.6 pts head-light, 16x19 string pattern
DNX 9: 98 sq.in., 320g, 68 flex, 312 swingwt., 5.6 pts head-light, 16x19 string pattern
Bab PCt: 100 sq.in., 327g, 63 flex, 325 swingwt., 5.6 pts head-light, 16x20 string pattern

[max_alvarado]

Max,
I'm in New Jersey.

oh, i was hoping you're in SoCal.   anyways, i've heard there's a big population of tennis playing filipinos there?   have u played erik taino who's from jersey i think?     heehe...

anyways, thanks again
max

[racketwiz]

Max

Glad it’s working out for you!

I’m familiar with the Tennis Warehouse racquet guide. I believe this was Don Hightower’s initiative when he joined Tennis Warehouse. Don was previously connected with the USRSA.  I get my specs directly from the USRSA’s testing lab.  There’s nothing wrong with the TW specs but I prefer the USRSA’s controlled and methodical testing.

The differences between the TW and USRSA specs also illustrates the fact that no two commercial racquets are alike, given the varying manufacturing tolerances that companies employ.  You can use either one as benchmark specs that will serve as a guide.  Your racquets’ actual specs can be determined with the proper equipment and will most likely differ slightly from the TW or USRSA benchmarks.

I know of Eric Taino (Jersey City, NJ), watched him play and practice for several years, spoke with him a few times. Nice guy. But no, we’re not bosom buddies, hehehe.

[SLP888]

I think Popet Lizardo is also there.

[raigoki]

Hi! im a newbie at tennis and i would like to know if there's some pointers on buying a tennis racquet for a beginner like me? im having some second thoughts whether to buy the prince force 3 ice titanium i saw in a sports shop. is it a beginner racquet? does a players height/weight ratio matters on choosing a racquet? im 6'2" and weighs 210lbs. (one of my reason why i choose to play tennis... to loose weight. hehe!) please help me out in buying a racquet... thanks a lot!

[ruud]

ur racquet will come to you sooner. if u generate ur own power and can control ur shots, u go midplus. if not, oversize.
many things u have to consider. as a beginner, look for racquets not more than 5K. then ... as u progress, try other racquets. then ... your racquet will present itself! hehehe

[gerikoh]

wow. so mr racquetwiz, do you string racquets professionally(with the exact tension and string pattern)?
and if so, how much do you charge?